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Players boycott games | Playoffs resume Saturday
(08-27-2020, 02:15 PM)fifteenth Wrote: You're still equating the reactions of NBA players to the rioters.


Where did I say that? Reactions of NBA players are also one of the things fueling rioters. Helps them to convince themselves they are right in what they are doing. That's why opinion makers should be more responsible.


(08-27-2020, 02:15 PM)fifteenth Wrote: NBA players were not calling for the officer to be sentenced.


They called for justice for Jacob and I asked a very simple question. Is THE SYSTEM working on justice for Jacob? It seems to me that it is. If the answer is yes, there is absolutely no need to call for justice. On the contrary - a call like this creates an impression that justice will not be (is not) served. And twitts were predominately about justice for Jacob in this specific case. To me, that is basically the same as calling for speedy justice based on the judgement you already provided.
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LOL, I got sucked into discussing the shooting in this thread

whatevs....I con't have the time or energy to seperate the threads

ya'll do what you want and try not to abuse one another 

sorry to the folks that would want these topics seperated, I don't have the time or energy

*shrug*


(08-27-2020, 02:23 PM)fifteenth Wrote: Of course, Blake...

shouldn't have kids with his girlfriend, Mama and Dada not living together is rough
shouldn't go to the women's house when she doesn' want him there
shouldn't resist arrest
shouldn't have a knife in his floor board

But none of that, in my mind, justifies shooting the guy in the back 7 times. 

But either way, there is no way around it, because of our (U.S.) history, a black man being shot in the back 7 times is going to be a gut punch to the country. 

Look,

Officers have to be able to handlle these situations better
The rioters are flat out wrong (Blake's Mom says this)
We have half the country saying trigger happy cops are the problem and half saying rioters are the problem. 
I say both are problems!!!


You see we can agree. This is exactly a type of message NBA players should be giving.


(08-27-2020, 02:23 PM)fifteenth Wrote:
(08-27-2020, 02:15 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: So again I know people want to make up their minds instantly and not change it no matter what details come later but here we have a few details like a) arrest b) taser c) knife in the driver's side floorboard, which was the door he opened. This is in addition to knowing that the cops were ordering him to stop and he was ignoring them. 

So again does resisting arrest and attempting to either get away in a car or grab a knife mean you deserve to get shot 7 times? I don't know but I am pretty sure resisting arrest increases your odds of getting injured or killed. I would like to know more ab police protocol in these type of situations.

Finally, my issue with all these stories is that there is really little thought given to the full context of what happened. Can you call something disturbing without immediately jumping to a final conclusion? It's seems to me that the latter happens with no due process. This isn't helping the conversion imo.


Of course, Blake...

shouldn't have kids with his girlfriend, Mama and Dada not living together is rough
shouldn't go to the women's house when she doesn' want him there
shouldn't resist arrest
shouldn't have a knife in his floor board

But none of that, in my mind, justifies shooting the guy in the back 7 times. 

But either way, there is no way around it, because of our (U.S.) history, a black man being shot in the back 7 times is going to be a gut punch to the country. 

Look,

Officers have to be able to handlle these situations better
The rioters are flat out wrong (Blake's Mom says this)
We have half the country saying trigger happy cops are the problem and half saying rioters are the problem. 
I say both are problems!!!

I would like to know police procedures on when they can use deadly force. I think the 7 times part is going to be tough to defend. On the other side are we going to say that people resisting arrest should just be allowed to flee the scene? Maybe? I think that could have some societal consequences but maybe that's better than what we have.

I think for example chasing shoplifters is a total waste of time and has gotten people injured or killed in the past. Why anybody thinks they should chase a shoplifter is beyond me. The crime is not worth it. Now go from that and work your way up to more serious crimes. At what point do you lose a grip on law and order bc people just don't respect the police as an institution? I wonder about this.

(08-27-2020, 02:27 PM)omahen Wrote:
(08-27-2020, 02:23 PM)fifteenth Wrote: Of course, Blake...

shouldn't have kids with his girlfriend, Mama and Dada not living together is rough
shouldn't go to the women's house when she doesn' want him there
shouldn't resist arrest
shouldn't have a knife in his floor board

But none of that, in my mind, justifies shooting the guy in the back 7 times. 

But either way, there is no way around it, because of our (U.S.) history, a black man being shot in the back 7 times is going to be a gut punch to the country. 

Look,

Officers have to be able to handlle these situations better
The rioters are flat out wrong (Blake's Mom says this)
We have half the country saying trigger happy cops are the problem and half saying rioters are the problem. 
I say both are problems!!!


You see we can agree. This is exactly a type of message NBA players should be giving.

Have you heard any player or coach of any sport condemn rioting and violence?
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You've equated NBA players and rioters multiple times. And you did it again in this thread. NBA players aren't influencing rioters. The rioting is it's own thing. There is history here that goes back a long way that you could go research if you wanted to, rather than rushing to judge without the info. Also, calling for justice doesn't mean calling for a sentencing. It can't. A sentence would take months or years to reach.

(08-27-2020, 02:28 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: I would like to know police procedures on when they can use deadly force. I think the 7 times part is going to be tough to defend. On the other side are we going to say that people resisting arrest should just be allowed to flee the scene? Maybe? I think that could have some societal consequences but maybe that's better than what we have.

I think for example chasing shoplifters is a total waste of time and has gotten people injured or killed in the past. Why anybody thinks they should chase a shoplifter is beyond me. The crime is not worth it. Now go from that and work your way up to more serious crimes. At what point do you lose a grip on law and order bc people just don't respect the police as an institution? I wonder about this.


Yeah, good questions, I'm with you


(08-27-2020, 02:05 PM)IamDougieFresh Wrote: I think something players could use their platform for is trying to make body cameras mandatory for all refs nationwide.

Fixed it
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41,127


(08-27-2020, 02:28 PM)StepBackJay Wrote: Have you heard any player or coach of any sport condemn rioting and violence?


No, but I haven't researched that. I think they should. Blake's mom did.

(08-27-2020, 02:27 PM)omahen Wrote: You see we can agree. This is exactly a type of message NBA players should be giving.


that's not the message you've been delivering

you've just been revealing that you have no idea what the players are going through and that you think they should be as dispassionate as you, who have no skin in the game except a desire to watch basketball. You seem like a reasonable guy. I think you should find someone to talk to about the experiences of black men and women in the U.S. Kam suggested empathy at some point, and that might have been the best message given so far in these discussions.
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(08-27-2020, 02:33 PM)ThunderMav Wrote:
(08-27-2020, 02:05 PM)IamDougieFresh Wrote: I think something players could use their platform for is trying to make body cameras mandatory for all refs nationwide.

Fixed it

Robotics and AI will save us from these assholes one day
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(08-27-2020, 02:33 PM)fifteenth Wrote: that's not the message you've been delivering


Of course it is. I don't understand how you can't held players accountable to be equally responsible in their PUBLIC comments about real life events as they are responsible about their comments for basketball related events.
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(08-27-2020, 02:49 PM)omahen Wrote: Of course it is. I don't understand how you can't held players accountable to be equally responsible in their PUBLIC comments about real life events as they are responsible about their comments for basketball related events.


You and I get into these back and forths regarding basketball where you lose me. That's now happened here. You haven't delivered the message I delivered above. And I don't even understand what you're talking about with this post.

It's most likely better for the forum if you and I don't have a back and forth. I'm sure it's exhausting to read.


https://twitter.com/kylegoon/status/1299054674746781696

https://twitter.com/nbcsandiego/status/1...6531030017


(08-27-2020, 02:59 PM)fifteenth Wrote: where you lose me


??? Or is it perhaps you lost me? No possibility that happened?

I can try to summarize. You basically said police shooting black man 7 times in the back is wrong and I should understand why black players reacted emotionally and this is totally fine.

I said this specific case might not be that simple and there might be a scenario possible, where police reaction was correct. Therefor players should be more careful and responsible with their judgements and consequent reactions.


Than we used thousands of words trying to explain our basic stance and convince each other.
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https://twitter.com/PR_NHL/status/1299104547302977538


Bottom line, most of you have never experienced being Black in America, what we go through on the daily, so your comments go on deaf ears to me. Its JUSTus.


(08-27-2020, 05:09 PM)HoosierDaddyKid Wrote: Bottom line, most of you have never experienced being Black in America, what we go through on the daily, so your comments go on deaf ears to me. Its JUSTus.
I'll probably regret this, but what the hell.  You are right...I have never experienced being Black in America.  But I have experienced prejudice, and I DO see prejudice, racial tension and inequality almost every day.  Your contention that it is only you (Black people) is totally wrong.  "You" (Black people...Hispanic, Asian, etc.) will never achieve "equality" without the participation of "white people."  We should all be working together.  It's all of us...together. 

As for the police...they have lost their way.  Instead of serving and protecting the "public"...they now CONFRONT, ESCALATE, and ELIMINATE...the "public."  The police are politicized, so we must look to our politicians for help.  But "our" (yours and mine) politicians only care about their respective parties, solidifying personal power, and lining their own pockets.  So...you and me (Black and White, etc.) must work together to force change in this country.  Riots are not the answer.

I'm going to stop now because when I try to give advice to, or help young people (my family, etc.) it does indeed..."fall on deaf ears."
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Yeah, well, I've never been a baseball fan, but I think I'm going to start watching a bit, just to see what the games and broadcasts are like.  If they also are going to preach social justice to me during ball games, then I'll be out of there too.  The NBA seems to be doing everything in their power to drive me away.  And don't say it's because I don't care about injustice, because I do.  But I already know injustice when I see it and I don't need sports broadcasters and players to continually remind me of it while I'm trying to escape from every day life and enjoy a ball game.
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Respect to fifteenth for stepping up to a difficult job in moderating this emotionally incendiary thread. Also Kamm and SH for standing up.


Yet another temper tantrum based on fabricated narratives and conjecture resulting in a boycott of an unrelated industry that will result in absolutely nothing. That's the reality we live in and the fans are showing their hand by not watching. This coming from a black man living in this country, of almost half a centuries age, calling all this garbage for what it is--the idolatry of malcontents and their ignorance of authority.

And Thunder, i'm with you 100% bro.
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https://twitter.com/ShamsCharania/status...2760631297

https://twitter.com/MarcJSpears/status/1...4398036992


(08-27-2020, 08:26 PM)mavsluvr Wrote: Respect to fifteenth for stepping up to a difficult job in moderating this emotionally incendiary thread. Also Kamm and SH for standing up.

Hey thanks bud. My 2 cents are worth less than dirt, but that doesn't stop me from tryin to hand it out haha! 

But all respect to fifteenth. He was right on top of the issue and was trying the best he can!

And to everyone; we are discussing and trying how best to moderate. As you all know we like to be as hands off as possible. Everyone is free to share their thoughts,  we just want to make sure that people who just want basketball stuff will only see basketball stuff. 

So far this thread has turned into the de-facto thread to discuss the shooting and the fallout from it. So as long as it's kept in here and kept civil there shouldn't be any more moderating going on in this thread.
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14x All-Star, 12x all-NBA, 1x MVP, 1x Finals MVP, 1 NBA Championship: Dirk Nowitzki, the man, the myth, the legend.


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