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Bible Study 2: Genesis 2 (10/28-11/03)
#1
For the next study lets move the story forward slightly. Genesis 1 covered the creation of the world and it's flora while Genesis 2 focuses in on the creation of humans. 

Here's the passage:

These are the generations
of the heavens and the earth when they were created,
in the day that the Lord God made the earth and the heavens.


When no bush of the field[a] was yet in the land[b] and no small plant of the field had yet sprung up—for the Lord God had not caused it to rain on the land, and there was no man to work the ground, and a mist[c] was going up from the land and was watering the whole face of the ground— then the Lord God formed the man of dust from the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living creature. And the Lord God planted a garden in Eden, in the east, and there he put the man whom he had formed. And out of the ground the Lord God made to spring up every tree that is pleasant to the sight and good for food. The tree of life was in the midst of the garden, and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.
10 A river flowed out of Eden to water the garden, and there it divided and became four rivers. 11 The name of the first is the Pishon. It is the one that flowed around the whole land of Havilah, where there is gold. 12 And the gold of that land is good; bdellium and onyx stone are there. 13 The name of the second river is the Gihon. It is the one that flowed around the whole land of Cush. 14 And the name of the third river is the Tigris, which flows east of Assyria. And the fourth river is the Euphrates.
15 The Lord God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to work it and keep it. 16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, “You may surely eat of every tree of the garden, 17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat[d] of it you shall surely die.”
18 Then the Lord God said, “It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for[e] him.” 19 Now out of the ground the Lord God had formed[f] every beast of the field and every bird of the heavens and brought them to the man to see what he would call them. And whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name. 20 The man gave names to all livestock and to the birds of the heavens and to every beast of the field. But for Adam[g] there was not found a helper fit for him. 21 So the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and while he slept took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh. 22 And the rib that the Lord God had taken from the man he made[h] into a woman and brought her to the man. 23 Then the man said,
“This at last is bone of my bones
    and flesh of my flesh;
she shall be called Woman,
    because she was taken out of Man.”[i]

24 Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh. 25 And the man and his wife were both naked and were not ashamed.



If folks are interested enough to keep this going, there will be times where we change up the questions, but for Genesis 2, let's keep the same questions going:

Questions

1. How would you summarize the meaning of this passage? How would you tell someone verbally what this passage said or meant? 

2. What does this passage tell us about God?

3. What does this passage tell us about Humanity? 

4. If this passage is true, what does it say about how we should live?
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#2
1) This passage tells us about the purpose, place, and role of human beings and relation to God. 

2) God is intimately involved in the making of his creatures. And God even puts part of himself into them. God also sees and meets every need of his creatures.

3) Humans are created to live among the trees. Humans are in the image of their parents, soil (mother earth) and spirit (Father God). Humans are created to serve and protect the creation of God. Humans are created for community (of which marriage is paradigmatic). Humans are created to have limits and bounds which are set by the Creator and must not be trespassed. Male and female are two parts or "sides" of the fullness of humanity. Humans were created to be vulnerable ("naked") before each other and the Creator and to be without shame while living in the "light" (openness and honesty) of such vulnerability. 

4) Again, similar to the previous passage, it speaks to humanity's integrated role to be within the creation as servant and protector while also accepting limitedness (something humans do NOT do well at all).


#3
(10-29-2019, 11:29 AM)Kammrath Wrote: 1) This passage tells us about the purpose, place, and role of human beings and relation to God. 

2) God is intimately involved in the making of his creatures. And God even puts part of himself into them. God also sees and meets every need of his creatures.

3) Humans are created to live among the trees. Humans are in the image of their parents, soil (mother earth) and spirit (Father God). Humans are created to serve and protect the creation of God. Humans are created for community (of which marriage is paradigmatic). Humans are created to have limits and bounds which are set by the Creator and must not be trespassed. Male and female are two parts or "sides" of the fullness of humanity. Humans were created to be vulnerable ("naked") before each other and the Creator and to be without shame while living in the "light" (openness and honesty) of such vulnerability. 

4) Again, similar to the previous passage, it speaks to humanity's integrated role to be within the creation as servant and protector while also accepting limitedness (something humans do NOT do well at all).


 I like this alot, Kam. I'm gonna make it a goal this week to not only answer the questions myself but to also interact with your answers.


#4
Needs more particilation


#5
(11-03-2019, 12:27 AM)balldontliez Wrote: so adam and eve were related and we're all related to them? this whole human race thing is incest?

https://www.inquisitr.com/5177309/new-re...years-ago/


#6
(11-03-2019, 02:16 PM)Kammrath Wrote:
(11-03-2019, 12:27 AM)balldontliez Wrote: so adam and eve were related and we're all related to them? this whole human race thing is incest?

https://www.inquisitr.com/5177309/new-re...years-ago/

That article seems a bit misleading, especially the headline calling them a “couple”, since they never met each other. 

This video does a better job summarizing the scientific findings imo and also lists 20+ sources in the video description box citing all the information, data, and research:

https://youtu.be/YNQPQkV3nhw
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#7
I never got back to this last week and am just now responding to the questions, so I'll keep it going for another week. 


(10-28-2019, 08:57 AM)fifteenth Wrote: 1. How would you summarize the meaning of this passage? How would you tell someone verbally what this passage said or meant? 

2. What does this passage tell us about God?

3. What does this passage tell us about Humanity? 

4. If this passage is true, what does it say about how we should live?


1. After telling the story of God's creation of the world, the author(s) focus in on the climax of creation. The passage suggests that creation is missing something without humans. "...there was no man to work the ground." God creates humanity and breathes his life into them, creates a place for them to live on the earth, gives them a job and purpose, and creates them male and female so that they wouldn't be alone. 

2. This passage zeros in on God's purpose for creation. God wanted to co-work with humanity to fill and govern the earth. I think it's really cool that God is like that. He wants a family and he wants to do stuff with them. That's awesome. He provided for their needs in an abundant way, planting them a garden and giving them access to all the food there. Also, he didn't create robots. He gave humans a choice about whether they would trust God and do things His way, or mistrust him and take the path that God told them not to take. He loved them and gave them a choice about whether they would love him. 

3. Humanity was created to be in relationship with God, relationship with each other, and to perform meaningful work. As stated above, humanity was given a choice about whether to trust God and enjoy his abundant gifts, or disobey God and forge their own way. 

4. This passage makes me want to discern in my choices the path that jives with trusting God, and going His way, rather than mistrusting God and forging my own path. It also makes me want to talk to work hard, work with God, and live in meaningful relationships with people.

(11-03-2019, 12:27 AM)balldontliez Wrote: o adam and eve were related and we're all related to them? this whole human race thing is incest?

There are a lot of rabbit trails off of this question that are fun to talk about and I'm not sure where you'd want to go with it. But my first thought is just that the Bible wasn't written as a science or history book. I have no doubt in my mind that God created the universe, earth, life on earth, and humans, but the Bible doesn't propose to tell us the nuts and bolts about how he did that. 

The Bible is telling the story of God. Historical events are a huge player in the Bible but the narratives are written to accomplish other purposes than to just give us a step by step account of human history. The purposes of the narrative are to tell what God is like, what He's doing, and how we can join Him (among other things). You could say that Bible writers co-opt history to do theology, while using other types of literature to do theology as well. 

So the story of Adam and Eve could be about the first humans, it could be about real people who weren't the first humans, or it could be a parable. Theologized historical narrative isn't the only genre used by writers of the Hebrew scriptures. There is a ton of great discussion out there about this topic, and smart people that love God differ on where they fall regarding who exactly the historical Adam and Eve were. 

But, Genesis 1 and 2 are are some of the richest, deep and meaning packed pieces of literature that have ever been produced. We're just barely scratching the surface in these threads. These chapters, plus a few others, lay out the foundation for the entire story of the Bible and are full of awesome Easter eggs and hyperlinks to the rest of the Bible. The question of the historical Adam and Eve is interesting and fun, but it might be the least important item in the treasure trove of these chapters.


#8
(11-05-2019, 12:15 AM)balldontliez Wrote: if the bible is true, this god seems like a raging murderous jealous trolling maniac who moonlights as a deadbeat dad. i would not wish to worship this god out of fear or any other reason. 

the bible contains some nice writing and jesus was highly quotable like delonte west. even if his suggestions werent always practical, like turning your cheek to let your attacker hit your other side.


To the first point:

I would argue only a misreading of the "Bible" leads to the conclusion of a "raging murderous jealous trolling maniac"....I would be happy to talk through ANY text where you get this impression and show you otherwise by looking at the arc of the story.

To the second point:

Yes, Jesus was NOT "practical." He was suggesting a way of life based on faith in the Creator Father. Jesus's Way is completely non-sensical if there is no Creator Father who is provider, protector, judge, vindicator, and bringer of justice. Jesus did NOT believe in "non-violence" like Gandhi did, as a political means to accomplish goals. Jesus believed in "non-violence" as an extension of his belief in the sacredness of life and the justice of his Father. Completely different notions of "non-violence."
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#9
(11-05-2019, 12:15 AM)balldontliez Wrote: this is the kind of well thought informative reply ive come to expect from you. i love knowing what people believe and why. 

what is really fascinating to me is that someone as smart as you can have no doubt god exists, without any evidence besides an old book. people thousands or just hundreds of years couldnt look at stuff under a microscope, they couldnt see inside the human body. so its understandable they believed these things to try and explain the world. and it couldnt be disproven as easily as today. 

but now, we know a lot of stuff in the bible isnt possible. theres no raising from the dead or immaculate conception from a god to a virgin (which is rapey anyway).

if the bible is true, this god seems like a raging murderous jealous trolling maniac who moonlights as a deadbeat dad. i would not wish to worship this god out of fear or any other reason. 

the bible contains some nice writing and jesus was highly quotable like delonte west. even if his suggestions werent always practical, like turning your cheek to let your attacker hit your other side.



thanks for the compliment, and thanks for your thoughts

I wouldn't say that I believe "without any evidence besides an old book", but the book is amazingly awesome. Regarding your thoughts about what the Bible says about who God is, I've hear those things in the public discourse, but they don't fit the actual story of the Bible.


#10
(11-09-2019, 03:41 AM)balldontliez Wrote: sodom and gomorrah? when god told abraham to kill his son as a sacrifice and then was like lol jk dont


Sodom and Gomorrah:

The Biblical narrative is all about human rebellion against the created order. This is manifested in Cain, the son of Adam and Eve who kills (takes life that God has created) and builds the first city (a sterile, life-destroying environment antithetical to the garden setting). This whole endeavor the Scriptures refers to as "the world" which I think is best translated as "Civilization." Sodom and Gomorrah as well as Babylon and Egypt become the prototypes and archetypes of this. The way of life that Civilization lives is inherently self-destructive and destructive to the rest of the creation. So throughout the OT we see the manifestation of the "judgment of God" against Civilization. God is allowing passively or even actively participating in the destruction of Civilization (see the flood, Sodom & Gomorrah, Egypt's plagues, Jericho, Isaiah 6 reference to the cities of Israel, etc.). God is doing this to SAVE his actual creation and created order. God is all about this salvation and every judgment he allows or brings is with this refining fire and cleansing intent. Like a forest fire is necessary for the restoration of the environment, so too is the destruction of human Civilization necessary as a salvific act for God's created order.

Abraham & Isaac:

One of the great idols in the Biblical narrative is the family system. The family puts itself in the place of God and the family is also about procreation and attaining immortal or eternal life (you live on through your children and they are hope for a new world). God is actively through the whole narrative saying that our families (going back to Cain) are NOT going to save us. Yet God wants to create his OWN kind of family. He does this through the childless couple of Abraham and Sarah. This will be a different and holy family not about human control, Civilization, etc. They resist this and with Hagar try to play the family system game. God rejects this and finally brings Isaac from a dead womb. This is GOD'S child, not theirs. So God needs to teach Abraham to have a light grip on his son. This is the test that Abraham faces. Will you obediently let go of your child and surrender your control over making something of yourself and trying to fix this world? Abraham passes the test by obeying and trusting that even if Isaac dies, God can raise the dead and will make his family somehow, someway, even "from the stones" as Jesus and John the Baptist say. Jesus echoes this by saying in Luke 14 no one can follow him who does not "disown" ("hate" is a bad translation) his wife, children, father, mother, brothers, and sisters and even his own life. Family is an idol that is destructive and oftentimes deeply rooted in Civilization. God is trying to save us from that.


#11
(11-12-2019, 02:35 AM)balldontliez Wrote: god trying to save us from himself


I am confused. Did I say this or give this impression?


#12
Can you explain the story of Job? I have always struggled with it.
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Bible Study 2: Genesis 2 (10/28-11/03)00